Name:QuebecIndieAnna •
Title: Extra-Denominational Communion •
Date posted: 01/05/08 14:03
Q: I have some questions about where we as humans are going in matters of our religious denominations :
Should dogmatic considerations be revisited?
Mine? Yours?
Does doing text analysis in an interdenominational setting bring humans to stand common ground ?
What about our various rituals ?
Should I be curious about the importance of :
- sugar in Islam;
- bread and wine in Christianity;
- meat in Inuit (esquimo) cultures;
- corn in American Indian cultures;
- women in Celtic pre-Christian spirituality;
- the amazing conversation Jews have had with their God over the centuries?
- What about India's ancient religions?
If the Muslim geneous Ibn Rusht (Averoes) was alive, if Martin Luther King was alive, how would their conversation go ?
I am from an Irish and French-Canadian Catholic tradition. I grew up partly in secular France. Interest in text analysis brought me to studies of Bible literature.
A film-maker has shared with the world his ability to be curious about literary traditions of 2 world religions : Judaism and Christianity. On screen, he takes obvious joy in quoting verses from a Testament that I do not know to be that of his familial religion.
Should we, as a human race, become curious about the history of the literary tradition of other faiths?
What would come of such curiosity?
I am not from the US. But I remember a famous quote from US author, Mark Twain. He said :
" East is east and west is west and never the 'twain' shall meet " .
Was he perhaps wrong?
Should they?
How ?
Becoming genuinely curious about the literary tradition of others, would do what for humanity ?
I recently watched a documentary about how infra-red satellite images helped find, in Saudi Arabia, ancient, pre-Islam, trade routes. The Museums in Bagdad have tablets with five of the 'Commandments' Moses re-edited. That tablet pre-dates Moses by several hundred years.
Should religions be willing to revisit their respective histories of dogmatic development?
The Churches in my land are big enough to allow inter-faith literary analysis classes. I would go to my Church to listen to a scholar from another faith explain other symbol, other rituals, other texts.
Reading, these past few days, some of the pages from James Tabor's site has enlightened me :
- I found out that one Gospel has a woman anointing the feet, another the head of Jesus.
- I found out that one Gospel n a m e s the women
a t the crucifixion
a t the burial
a t the Sunday morning visit to the tomb
and
another Gospel does not name the women...
Using the Gospel of Mark, the earliest, as a spring board, Mr. Tabor shows some of the ways in which the other Gospels were (the process) of their construction.
What would becoming curious about how ancient literature was constructed do to inter-faith relations?
Quebec Indie Anna
Name:Panluna •
Date: 01/06/08 19:40
A: When I joined the New Age movement I became multi-religion.I've always had an interest in culteral anthropology but I never had a formal college education. I believe that in the feeling and spirit of universal understanding an education in all the world's religions will bring about better relationships and hopefully world peace.Differences should never lead us to war.But history repeats itself when we don't learn the lessons our predecssors learned.
Name:Panluna •
Date: 01/06/08 20:00
A: And putting faith in lies does not produce miracless.it only causes conflict.The Truth stands on it's own and never changes except in perpective.
Name:QuebecIndieAnna •
Date: 01/07/08 4:43
A: Hi Panluna,
To what you said, I can only say
Amen.
Indie
Name:sam •
Date: 01/17/08 19:35
A: Hello Panluna,
I do join Indie, and say Amen.
What yous said here : "And putting faith in lies does not produce miracless.it only causes conflict.The Truth stands on it's own and never changes except in perpective." is great, and it is the truth.
But sometime (mainly when we go back in history) the true is mixed with the false, and the lies mixed with the truth, and make things hard to unserstand, but when such a thing goes for thousand of years and because of luck of education and knowledge then everything became as true and represents the truth, no matter what !.
It is very hard for those to accept anything else, and they will (that goes for all the people, of all religions and all beliefs), stick to what they got. The scientific facts and the logic has no place, and cannot be accepted, and they try to create their own methods of analyzing (under different names) to prove the wrong right and the right wrong, and that is a big field of philosophical studies, which has no end to it.
THE TRUTH STANDS ON IT'S OWN. The people should not be afraid from it , or fight for it. Aiming for the truth, and the whole tuth suppose to be a target, away from personal gain or saving face. Einstein admitted that he was wrong and went to visit Mr. Hubble who showed him the truth. Both are great men, and we all do admire Einstein for His works and for his open mind.
We are in a different age, the age of freedom. I think you know what was it like few centuries ago?.
The NUN Mary Ann collins wrote in “Unmasking Catholicism”:
“Forbidden people to interpret the bible for themselves.”.......
That was the policy of the church not long time ago. And she added "“ The interpretation left to the popes, bishops, those the brilliant ones who call themselves the ruler of the world, and the holiest men on earth.
The Muslims has the same. When some Imams create their own works away from the Islam teachings and forced the others to follow.
And so with the Jews, when their leaders forced the people to stand with them against Jesus and spread lies about Him and his teaching, ans after they joined forces with the Christians and fabricated lies about Muhammad and the Quran. Those are facts, and the words of God for love and peace changed to become the words of the leaders for hate and war.
God help us, and God bless you all.
Name:Jesussaveyou •
Date: 01/17/08 21:30
A: I thought Jewish loves Christian and consider us brothers. But totally wrong they distort the true history of Jesus Christ and the foundation of the body of Christ/church/. If someone challenges them and tells the truth they call you anti Semitic and mention holocausts as excuse for their deeds.
I got some answer about what they believe and teachings from this site take time and read some of the articles.
http://www.revisionisthistory.org/
Name:QuebecIndieAnna •
Date: 01/17/08 22:29
A: Hello J Saves You.
The site you refer to (that of M. Hoffman) and its " revisionist views ", denies the Holocaust.
As one having been raised on the border between France and Germany in the 60s, a mere 15 years after the war, I witnessed first-hand the sheer hatred of one group of people for another. I saw with my eyes the numbers tatoed onto the arms of the parents and grand-parents of my primary school friends, who had been in the camps.
You have in me a witness, who lived 20 minutes from the France-German border, in the 60s. Yes, I witnessed hatred in the hearts of Jews for Christians. But, by far, I witnessed far more hatred for Jews in the hearts of Christians.
This site exists because of the deep love and respect of a Jew for Christians Scripture and tradition.
This site exists because of the deep love and respect of a Jew for
bringing to light the bone boxes of a man and of a woman who
spoke a message of love.
I am deeply disturbed by your post.
I am deeply saddened by your post.
I am deeply surprised by your name (J saves you) and the contradiction of what you write.
I do not care to have you contribute to a page I began, in the spirit of mutual respect.
I have not clicked the " Poor Taste " button on this site,
and have you removed from this site, but I will if you post your
views again.
Indie Anna
Name:sam •
Date: 01/17/08 22:55
A: Jesussaveyou,
Jesus came to save the children of Israel, and to bring them back to the teaching of God, and they hated Him, because HE is ruinning their business. Then came Muhammad , and they hated Him too, and while the Muslims treated them well and better than the Christians (Spain, Germany, and everywhere else), they turn back and joined forces with them against the Muslims, WHY ?, because of their business.
The Jews used Paul to get in {sneak in using a lie -a vision}with the followers of Jesus, to twist His message and to devide His people.
The argument between Paul and Bernabas, the one who sold his land to support Jesus and the Apostles, and name him names, then came to stand against PETER, the one whom Jesus Himself called Him the ROCK OF THE CHURCH.
Paul created the son of man formula, which led to the creation of the trinity by Constantine, and also that happen by another VISION.
From Paul and Constantene teaching came all what came after from killing and burning people alive. If the people followed Jesus teaching everything became different, and the love and peace take place all around the world.
Here some of the words of Paul: " THROUGH MY LIE "...."LET US DO EVIL "...."LET NO ONE THINK ME FOOLISH"...."SHALL I COME TO YOU WITH A ROD"...."I HAVE MADE MYSELF A SLAVE TO ALL, SO THAT I MAY WIN MORE." { that is from the Jewish Paul, and that is the policy of his followers.}
1Corinthians-9:19 .... I HAVE MADE MYSELF A SLAVE TO ALL, SO THAT I MAY WIN MORE.
1Cor- 9:20 TO THE JEWS I BECAME AS A JEW; SO THAT I MIGHT WIN JEWS; TO THOSE WHO ARE UNDER THE LAW, AS UNDER THE LAW THOUGH NOT BEING
MYSELF UNDER THE LAW, AS UNDER THE LAW, SO THAT I MIGHT WIN THOSE WHO ARE UNDER THE LAW;
1COR- 9:21 TO THOSE WHO ARE WITHOUT LAW, AS WITHOUT LAW OF GOD BUT UNDER THE LAW OF CHRIST, SO THAT I MIGHT WIN THOSE WHO ARE WITHOUT LAW.
— Paul is a man with many faces, and all his thought is about winnings, it does not matter how, and he will use any method to achieve his plans, rods, lies, and even robing the churches.
2COR. - 11: 8 I ROBBED OTHER CHURCHES by taking wages from them to serve you.
— He confessed that he robed the churches, to give the others as a service to win them, and THAT IS A BRIBE, TO WIN , and he told us all that before in [1cor 9:20/21].
— The question now is, why he does all those awful and bad things?. The answer will be found in his words:
1COR. - 9:18 WHAT THEN IS MY REWARD? That, when I preach the gospel, I MAY OFFER THE GOSPEL WITHOUT CHARGE, so as not to make full use of my right in the gospel.
- NOTHING FOR FREE, NOT EVEN PREACHING THE WORD OF GOD .
1COR.- 9:23 I DO ALL THINGS for the sake of the gospel, SO THAT I MAY BECAME A FELLOW PARTAKER OF IT.
- Of course he achieved his plans. His personal letters became a major part in the Bible [partaker of it] , and his words became more used and accepted than the words of Jesus, so when Jesus mention Himself as the son of man and prophet, and Paul said Jesus the son of God, the people will accept Paul’s word and not the word of Jesus .
Galattians-1:20 Now in what I am writing to you, I ASSUR YOU BEFORE GOD THAT I AM NOT LYING.
Romans-9:1 I AM TELLING THE TRUTH in Christ, I AM NOT LYING, MY CONSCIENCE TESTIFIES WITH ME in the holy spirit.
{ I ROBBED ...LET US DO EVIL ...THINK ME FOOLISH ... I MAY OFFER THE GOSPEL WITHOUT CHARGE?.... THROUGH MY LIE...I AM NOT LYING...I AM NOT LYING...I DO ALL THINGS . WHY?, SO THAT I MAY BECAME A FELLOW PARTAKER OF IT.}
— “what proceeds out of the mouth, this defiles the man.” Jesus always spoke the truth.
God bless you.
Name:QuebecIndieAnna •
Date: 01/18/08 2:07
A: Message for JSaveYou,
Your remarks are anti-Semitic.
I do not want to have any exchanges with you.
Indie
Name:Anchorite •
Date: 02/02/08 1:29
A: THE BEST GOSPEL IS St Thomas. Check that out. Then read the earliest version possible of the Tao Te Ching. Then manage an epiphany. Then get back to me.
MLH
Name:Panluna •
Date: 02/05/08 3:47
A: Anchorite,
Thanks for mentioning the Tao.Happy Mardi Gras!
Name:Panluna •
Date: 02/05/08 3:54
A: Last night I watched a program on the History Channel title BANNED FROM THE BIBLE.It was very interesting. answered many questions about the current Bible's developement and history.
Enjoy Mardi Gras Indie !! "Let the good times roll!"Someday I'm going to New Orleans to celebrate.
